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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/01/12 at 04:53 PM	Reply with quote #1

We all tend to justify form, if that form, can still do the job it was initially designed to do! Mastiffs were not designed for any one particular task. But those who owned them made use of their great size for various jobs. The smaller types could perform certain tasks better than their larger brethren and the larger types might fulfill other tasks better than the smaller types. That leaves the Mastiff fancier in a quandary, as to what type represents the correct type, or ideal for a working Mastiff? Since we don't have separate standards for a lesser type vs a greater type, we use a range of sizes within the standard. Yet despite this range, there are some fanciers that would only believe, that a Mastiff that could perform like a Bullmastiff on open ground is the ideal form! They will advocate for the Mastiff which just makes standard height and is not massive in bulk, to represent their ideal, and then justify that precept, by listing the athletic abilities of such types over larger more massive types, who cannot perform as well regarding endurance, or athletic capacities when compared to larger types. Several names who advocate that vision are Norman Howard Carp- Gordon, Charlotte Strong/Judy Nash and Col. David Hancock, just to name a few. These folks are not wrong in their rationale, since history and physics can support their opinions and give credibility to their arguments. That said, there is another viewpoint, that I believe equally as valid as the one just described. Since the job of the Mastiff has taken on a number of different roles in the historical past, we can make an equal argument in favor of greater size & bulk. The Masty of the house would be there to protect by imposing stature, and the Forest Laws, would mandate hambling/expeditation of the toes in order to PREVENT the athletic ability of such Mastiffs. Therefore, size was important for these owners, since motion & athletic ability was removed from the equation. In early Bear Garden work, it took 6 Mastiff types to overcome the bear, in later years, only three. This reduction in numbers, would indicate that smaller types were used early on and larger types deployed in the latter history of this blood sport. As a guardian at home, a larger type would be more sedentary and tend not to roam too far away from estate grounds, or children under their protection. It's one reason why the Bullmastiff was created! So we can see that the varied tasks given to the Mastiff of old, were indeed varied in nature, and not one particular form would be best, or ideal, to fulfill all tasks expected to be accomplished by a single type. Which leaves us back to the core issue raised, when size is addressed, or when debates emerge, as to which Mastiff form is correct, or ideal! It's one reason why standards are deployed. They are supposed to address such topics and resolve great variations regarding type. When the gap is too far apart, either standards get revised, or breeds split into two distinct camps under their own standards. I'm not certain as to where we stand as a group in this regard, but I will state, that this debate has gone on for well over 100 years without any resolve in sight. Therefore, either we continue to interpret standards as we may and ignore the variability we see ad infinitum, or we become cognizant of this issue and do something about it! It won't go away on it's own. Perhaps a guarding breed would be a more appropriate title for the Mastiff and as such, unless they are being designed to guard/herd sheep, we might be able to narrow the gap regarding type, size and our expectations of what the standard requires for an ideal. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/01/12 at 05:08 PM	Reply with quote #2

Addendum, I might add, that the term Working Mastiff can be misleading, in that it implies kinetic abilities, rather than impossing stature. A large bouncer at a bar doesn't have to run fast, or have great agility, in order to keep the peace! A Working Breed is a universal umbrella and should not be used to narrowly validate the Mastiff, which is a GUARDING breed and not subject to all of the parameters we expect in other working types. To use the analogy of the bouncer once again, they are working by just standing still! __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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WalnutCrest

Registered: 07/10/09
Posts: 749

Posted 07/01/12 at 06:02 PM	Reply with quote #3

Ah, yes, but the ginormous bouncer would still have to have the wherewithal (and motility) to control the na'er-do-well and escort them to the door and then to the wide world beyond. Simply standing around looking huge will deter some, but, if there is a problem needing to be addressed, if the large man in the corner cannot establish peace and remove the offenders, then the actual job of "bouncer" will not have been fulfilled as nobody will have actually been bounced. __________________ http://www.WalnutCrestMastiffs.com resources for rescue ==> http://www.englishmastiffrescue.net/ "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -- Aristotle "The most fundamental form of human stupidity is forgetting what we were trying to do in the first place." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/01/12 at 11:51 PM	Reply with quote #4

I'm not talking about a cardboard facsimile, but a bouncer's primary job is to prevent the need for bouncing through intimidation and size. A sound giant can act if needed, the equipment is there, even though the great stamina of a long distance runner may be wanting! Mastiffs need not go fifteen rounds with an opponent. If necessary, a short burst of 250 lb power is quite enough to solve any issues. It's why Rhino's don't run like Cheetahs and why giant guard dogs need not have the stamina and agility of working drover breeds. My Boulder once hit a Black & Tan Coonhound from a 40 ft run. The interaction was over in less than 2 seconds, seriously! And this was with the Coonhound's owner trying to kick & push Boulder off. Boulder never bit the dog once! The short term power of a large Mastiff in his prime is incredible! Agility never entered into the equation, it was brute force and momentum, a crude sledge hammer! __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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WalnutCrest

Registered: 07/10/09
Posts: 749

Posted 07/02/12 at 12:42 AM	Reply with quote #5

Ah, yes, but he did have to be able to get up and run sufficiently fast for 40 feet so that he could deliver the crucial blow! __________________ http://www.WalnutCrestMastiffs.com resources for rescue ==> http://www.englishmastiffrescue.net/ "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -- Aristotle "The most fundamental form of human stupidity is forgetting what we were trying to do in the first place." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 07:10 AM	Reply with quote #6

Of course and that's where being sound enters the picture. Smaller size, or larger size, should both be structurally sound. I'm just saying that a Mastiff doesn't need to be able to go all day, in order to fulfill the function of guard. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 10:07 AM	Reply with quote #7

Another form of working dog for a very specific job. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 10:14 AM	Reply with quote #8

__________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 10:18 AM	Reply with quote #9

Don't think a Mastiff would make the cut for the Iditarod, but then again I wouldn't want a Samoyed, or Husky guarding an estate. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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Olga

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Posted 07/02/12 at 01:04 PM	Reply with quote #10

Mastiffs were created to be a guardian, but in modern society, due to their size, people breeding out their guarding instincts, making them instead a lap dogs or sporting dogs... On the lighter note, I do have a true working dog here, Tristan : ) Olga Attached Images:
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 01:53 PM	Reply with quote #11

I think that people are breeding for good temperaments, which should mean a stable dog that can still have the capacity to protect, if called upon to do so. Conditioning for protection is a fine line, as it can go easily off track. A well socialized Mastiff may see everyone as a friend, and thus leaving himself and his owner more vulnerable to certain subtle forms of aggression. Barking vs direct intervention when called for, may be the result of too much familiarity with too many people. Inhibition should have a limit and any Mastiff that cannot go beyond that inhibition, when needed, is a useless guardian. Venue also has an affect on protective drives, where a Mastiff may be more protective at home versus another location. I saw this with Boswell, just to site one example. At Ed's home Boswell was more protective of strangers than at Ed's Antique business, or restaurant. My own Mastiff Raven was trained by me to be sharper than the others. I took her with me on a number of occasions into some of my stores at night when cash was collected. She was a dark brindle and was perfect for that job. Yet at home, she was perfectly relaxed and not on alert as much compared to when she was in the stores. On a lighter note, it's good to see & hear of a Mastiff carrying a bucket instead of kicking one! __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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Olga

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Posted 07/02/12 at 05:48 PM	Reply with quote #12

Mastiff, working dog... art work by my daughter Anastasia Korochanskaja Olga Attached Images:
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/02/12 at 06:14 PM	Reply with quote #13

Ana K. has talent, but her interpretation of the standard needs tweaking!...LOL __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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Tracy

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Posted 07/03/12 at 01:42 AM	Reply with quote #14

I know that we prefer the easier laid back temp in these giant dogs, but I think the inherent instinct to protect is there under the surface. When we were in Bucks and trenton, we stayed at the HOJO in trenton. When we came back from the bucks shows, the people next door had set up an xpen with dobes right behind our back door ( sliding glass) as we came in the room, the frenchies saw the dogs and the woman and barked, Tuck went full blast charging growling and lunging, and went right into the window, cannot believe he didnt bust it. In the eight years I have owned this dog I have never seen him get bowed up about much of anything. a lesson that the defender in him lies just below the surface. Not sure if he was protecting us girls, or his little french friends, but either way, he was in full attack mode, and it took me a bit to get him calmed down. I have only ever watched him get full of himself at strange cars ect at the gate, but never have I watched him act like this, hair up, tail stiff, surprised he didnt knock himself out as hard as he hit that window. __________________ Ranchlands Mastiffs http://www.ranchlandsmastiffs.com Member MCOA, SSMF, FAME Rescue Volunteer SSMR If you dont rescue, Dont Breed. We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 01:45 PM	Reply with quote #15

Telegraphed action is different from independent action. In your case, the Mastiff became part of the pack, which signaled an alert. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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Tracy

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Posted 07/03/12 at 02:13 PM	Reply with quote #16

regardless of the alert action, he responded, what more could you ask for? __________________ Ranchlands Mastiffs http://www.ranchlandsmastiffs.com Member MCOA, SSMF, FAME Rescue Volunteer SSMR If you dont rescue, Dont Breed. We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 02:42 PM	Reply with quote #17

No need to get defensive Tracy, but there is a difference, and just wanting you & others to recognize, that independent action without provocation (i.e. Frenchies) is a separate matter in behavior. That's not to say your boy wouldn't have reacted on his own in a similar manner, without the encouragement of the Frenchies. But we can't know this, since group behavior is different from independent, or individualistic actions. __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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Tracy

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Posted 07/03/12 at 03:46 PM	Reply with quote #18

Why why would youjump into the defensiveness position??? I have training in behavior and recognize it for what it is. The point I was trying to make is that under the surface of a normally very non confrontational dog he reacted, which was something out of the norm for him. We all know and understand pack behavior, and my thought wasimmediately he is defending the frenchies who alerted him to it in the first place, but this dog went thru some pretty rough times at 7 months tfear out three years, and has come out the other end with alot of confidence he did not posses as he was younger. I think that eveanecdotally there are many times when our calm. Collected dogs defend us spin some ways very subtly in others more blatant. On an another entire subject tuck has a job, he brings in the paper very morning, it's a very big production, and everyone is rewarded for his job, lol __________________ Ranchlands Mastiffs http://www.ranchlandsmastiffs.com Member MCOA, SSMF, FAME Rescue Volunteer SSMR If you dont rescue, Dont Breed. We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them. Albert Einstein
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 04:10 PM	Reply with quote #19

Quote: Why why would youjump into the defensiveness position??? It's simple Tracy, because your response looked defensive!............. Quote: regardless of the alert action, he responded, what more could you ask for? While I babysit my daughter's Chihuahua, I've discovered that this dog will bark for almost any noise that he hears. In a home filled with Chihuahuas, I would imagine that a chain reaction would take place every few minutes and make for a very noisey home. The ancient Chinese kept these small temple dogs around, in order to alert guards, or larger dogs used for protection. There is a survival feature in having highly sensitive breeds about, typically housed in very small bodies (e.g. toys). Larger types are slower to react, this is due in part to their larger size and indifference to minor doings, which might seem major to a smaller dog. It's why I spoke of independent action, compared to the startle effect, which may have provoked your dog into the action he may not have taken on his own initiative, if the Frenchies were not about. In either scenario, he pleased you, so I'll shut up! __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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dixierockstarr

Registered: 11/28/11
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Posted 07/03/12 at 05:47 PM	Reply with quote #20

Olga, I love your daughters artwork!!! Does she have a website? I would like to see more. __________________ Christin Member MCOA Mom to Bravo son of Intl Ch Dixie Rockstarr (RIP baby), Fiona our pound puppy, Chloe our kitty, And 3 handsome gentlemen Brockton, Christopher and Jordan
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KarenK

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Posted 07/03/12 at 06:00 PM	Reply with quote #21

I've observed an interesting dynamic at our place. As most of you know we have Bonnie, a pit something mix and have had dozens of rescues and visitors come through over the years. Usually, the dogs find a high resting place where they lie together and observe what's going on. When something catches their attention, Bonnie (or the visitors) will bark and run to see what it is or chase it off... while Finny rises and comes to attention and at-the-ready but hangs by the house intent on what is going on until his buddies return. I like to think that he's acting rather like a last line of defense and, to my mind, that is the job a Mastiff is meant to do. Makes me feel pretty well taken care of and reminds that he's not nearly as useless as I often judge him to be. __________________ Karen K. http://www.VonHimmelKennel.com Southern States Mastiff Rescue: http://www.sosmastiffrescue.org
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Olga

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Posted 07/03/12 at 06:17 PM	Reply with quote #22

Christine, there you go..balaa.deviantart.com/ Olga
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 07:20 PM	Reply with quote #23

http://balaa.deviantart.com/gallery/ __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 07:25 PM	Reply with quote #24

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/multimedia/video/Wolf_attack_(video_from_2007).html?cid=980200 __________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 07:31 PM	Reply with quote #25

__________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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KarenK

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Posted 07/03/12 at 07:36 PM	Reply with quote #26

Well, maybe not that intent. http://balaa.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d4scgqr Quote: Originally Posted by SteveOifer http://balaa.deviantart.com/gallery/ __________________ Karen K. http://www.VonHimmelKennel.com Southern States Mastiff Rescue: http://www.sosmastiffrescue.org
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SteveOifer

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Posted 07/03/12 at 07:40 PM	Reply with quote #27

__________________ For the betterment of the breed! "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman TEST YOUR DOGS!
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