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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #1 

My 8 month old mastiff has been eating real pig ears, steak bones, and those huge ham bones packaged in the stores (she loves those) since she was adopted my me. Well just recently she eats her pig ears in under 3 minutes the whole thing is gone, now I just gave her a porterhouse steak bone last nite and she was done in no time at all which it used to keep her busy for hours.  So at like 5:00 in the am i heard her throw up.  It was huge chunks of the steak bone. She swallowed them whole. I was scared!!  Can this damage her. How can i get her to sit and knaw at them instead of eating the whole bone. I never gave her rawhide because I heard it was not good for them, is this true? What do you all give your dogs for treats, (i dont mean bisquits) I want something for her to knaw on for a while without pieces being ingested. HELP!!


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Driventhattrain

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Reply with quote  #2 

Cooked steak bones can splinter which can puncture anything on the way down and out. We always give raw uncooked bones. We just go to the butcher and get raw beef bones - Kaboose takes forever with these. We also freeze them first so it's a little harder to chew the gunk off. We also feed him the beef bones and/or knuckles in the packages from pet stores but only when we are constantly watching him so he doesn't eat the actual bones. I have heard horror stories about pig ears, cow hoofs and raw hide so I never give it to him.


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Reply with quote  #3 
I also give raw bones. I don't like all the salt they have in pig ears. There are many good wholesome bones and knuckles without all the preservatives and sodium.
I would stop the pig ears and cooked bones immediately- you are worried now, don't second guess yourself.
Good Luck,
Bridget

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #4 

Ok, when u go to the butcher you just ask for these bones? Are they just bones they would throw away? What about the raw meat??? Can't they get things like samanella (spelled it wrong)???? Can they get chunks off like the cooked???


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MASTIFFAUNTIEB

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Reply with quote  #5 
They charge you a nominal fee for these bones. (compared to pig ears)
Dogs don't get salmanella but, that is from chicken anyway. If you feel the bones are too big most decent grocers will cut for you. The raw meat on the bones will be digested within an hour (as oppossed to kibble- 6 hours)
It won't be enough to upset her tummy and she will love you for hours!!
Ask for femurs and knuckles

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #6 

I am going to get some of these maybe this weekend. Now I can freeze these right? I figure I will get a bunch while i am there and freeze.  Isnt there something you get from raw beef, ..oh is it ecoli? Thats why humans are supposed to cook beef thouroughly. Thanks for the tips!!


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Driventhattrain

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Reply with quote  #7 
You can freeze them. I freeze them just to keep the challenge up for our little man. I eat med-rare to rare steaks so I am not really all that concerned with e coli. Plus there are people out there that do all raw diets for their dogs. I would think the throwing up might have been because everything was too rich and your dog is still a puppy. We limit one bone per 3-4 days. We take it from him after awhile and put it back in the freezer to give him the next day.  

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Reply with quote  #8 

Below is our experience with Rupert and a cow hoof that we posted previously on another thread.  Raw hides are very dangerous as well.

Blair

 

Sunday

8:30 p.m. – Rupert finished his normal dinner a little later than we normally feed the rest of the week but the same time for Sundays because Rosco has agility class.

9:00 – boys in crates after feeding as always to keep everyone quiet and from playing and give me a few minutes to do housework without 20 paws assisting.  Rupert restless and crying – thought he had to poop.  Let him outside.  No poop.  Wanted inside.  Let  him in and he was restless, panting and would lay down and get right back up.

9:30 – Rupert threw up, but only a bit of water came up (VERY small amount – tablespoon or so) – remained restless and panting afterwards

9:35 – Rupert barfed again – this time a small amount of kibble (eagle pack) – maybe ½-3/4 of a cup.  Still restless etc

9:40 – Rupert asked to go outside – walked around and tried to throw-up but unable to produce any vomit – came inside – had him lie down and abdomen behind ribs felt firm and SLIGHTLY swollen – I was unable to hear bowel sounds with stethoscope

9:45 – had my vet on phone – he was two+ hours away for Memorial Day holiday – told me Rupert would be dead before he could get there – and to go to our pre-planned back-up emergency vet NOW (only 10 minutes away) –like put the leash on and go out the door while we are talking – GO NOW.

10:00 – at emergency room – x-rays show bloat but no torsion and labs indicate lactate through the roof at 6.3 – decompression completed and follow-up x-rays show minimal air and kibble remain in stomach- Only food and air came out.  He was already going into shock.

1 am – we are sent home – (much protest) – Rupert came out of the anesthesia fine with no difficulty and was standing up and with it before we left – he is kept overnight and continued on fluid and medication (zantac and reglan for GI and pain meds etc)

4 am – repeat labs and x-rays are ok – no bloat/torsion and lactate coming down

5:30 am – steph really grumpy getting ready for a 12 hour shift in ICU at hospital….

Monday

Rupert did great all day at the hospital and tolerated small feedings without any problems.  Gastropexy recommended this week once he has had a few days to “recover” from this episode.

Spoke with regular vet regarding gastropexy – stated 100%, without hesitation, that it is a must.  Recommended surgeon to do it that does all of the military working dogs, which are ALL prophylactically done as puppies.  He is one of only a handful of vets that are doing it in the nation laproscopically and was actually the second in this country to use this technique.  Procedure scheduled for Thursday.

Blair took off work for three days to remain with him round the clock - Rupert is on 1-1/2 cup feedings of plain boiled chicken breast and rice (no seasons –nothing but just boiled meat and rice) every four hours around the clock with scheduled doses of reglan and zantac – he has done great no issues until surgery

Wednesday

Surgeon reviewed films from Sunday and performed pre-op lab work and discussed different calculations used for mastiff anesthesia (before I even asked, I wonder if my vet tipped him off to how I am, hmmm….)

Thursday

7:30 – Rupert dropped off for surgery –

9:30 – Received call from surgeon with Rupert on the operating table.  He thinks there is an object in Rupert’s stomach.  He needs to go in and see what it is.  Of course we give permission.

10:30 – Rupert out of surgery.  Surgeon found a large triangular piece of hoof in his stomach.  We have not given hooves and chews since the beginning of the year when Buster started swallowing large pieces and throwing them up (although we used them for years without incident - we always supervised and tried to prevent swallowing of pieces but when buster started gulping them down we quit giving them).  Surgeon stated it appeared to have been in there a LONG LONG time (many months).  He believes it shifted and blocked the pylorus and that is what caused the bloat on Sunday.  It was just luck they bumped it and found it.  They don’t show up on x-ray and he would have continued to have problems and we would have thought it was related to the gastropexy.

11:30 – Rupert awake and okay.  Vet says he is “happy go lucky”.  He is going to come home tonight for us to “pull an all nighter”.  He will go back in the morning and they will try a bit of water and he will stay with them through the day.  Saturday we will try a bit of food if all is well.

 

Without the forums I don’t think we would have been so urgent to call the vet on his cell phone late on a holiday.  We might have “waited to see how he does” and he would be dead now.  I thank everyone who has shared their experiences with bloat and all health issues.  Before we got Rupert we read everything we could find about mastiffs and your stories/advice saved his life.

 

The tips I got and used which I found most helpful plus my own thoughts are:

1:  Read everything you can BEFORE you have a mastiff or ASAP and know what to look for.

2:  Follow your gut if something just doesn’t seem right – better to be safe and look like a jack ass to the vet if turns out to be nothing, than to find out it really was something and have a dead dog.

3:  Have a way to contact your vet 24/7- if your vet isn’t willing to do that, find one that is.  Have a backup plan if you vet isn’t available.  Drive to the backup place one day when you have nothing to do – don’t get lost and be panicked even more when the emergency occurs.

4: wait to cry until after the vet takes the dog back – mastiffs are sensitive – this was hardest for me…….I am crying now too.

5: even if you feed good food, limit exercise before and after, do as much as you can, sometimes things happen.  It isn’t your fault.

6:  Have a savings account just for the dogs – between Buster’s ACL repair and this, it has been an expensive year and it is only May, but I would not want to be in the position to have to decide my dog’s life based on money issues.  I recommend $5000…seriously.

7:  Obedience train your dog – when he is sick is not the time to realize you can’t examine your dog/get him to lie down/get him into position for x-rays, blood draws, IV’s etc.

 

I might think of more later – since I will be up all night – lol

Corrected the times - realized I got off an hour, sorry.

Thank you to all who have posted about health stuff.

Steph


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Tracy

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Reply with quote  #9 
I do not feed raw hide at all, way to many times wrist deep pulling out a long macerated( thats fancey talk for wet meat) piece of rawhide out while they are choking or gewtting it stuck around the back teeth.
I also do not feed bones, b/c everyone here always thinks everybody elses bone is better than thiers., but if you do feed, feed raw bones, never cooked. Dogs can get salmonella, but most do not suffer the severity of the infection that people do, they have some pretty strong stomach acids that help kill off most bacteria. What was posted above, once they are bored and walk away, pick up the bone and stick it back in a freezer.
Pigs ears are another thing I dont give ( i have a friend who likes to give them to my dogs though) I have a couple that chew them up nicely, but another pair that pretty much swallow them whole, and I am back to pulling gook out of a throat, so I really dont like to go there. There is salt, and a thin layer of fat in pigs ears also.

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #10 

Is it normal for mercedes to be still vomiting slightly? She ate her food today but threw up a small amount here and there today. She just did again, I dont want to give her any bones for a while until she seems fine. Should I be worried? After reading Blairs story I am worried.  How would I know if there is something stuck in her belly or not? is there any other symptoms i should watch for? Yes, I never did give her rawhide for the fact all of you mentioned. 


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Tracy

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Reply with quote  #11 
It is not normal for her to still be vomiting, there may be another piece of bone lodged in her. I would get her to your vet for an xray as soon as you can. Is she vomiting all the food?? or just some of it. Does the food look like it has been digested at all or does it look the same as it when in?  These clues can tell you where the blockage is, and If there is one.
Good luck to you.

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #12 

no there is no food in the vomit, just a milky white liquid and its only a few tablespoons.


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MASTIFFAUNTIEB

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Reply with quote  #13 
Withhold her food until she gets an xray!
If the vet needs to give her anesthesia for her xrays than a plus.
And no food may let her gut settle too. She does need an xray better sooner than later. There may be a piece of bone left or it may just be a mess from that bone knocking around in there before.
I hope there is no bone and the vet doesn't recommend surgical intervention.
Good Luck and keep us updated.
I'm very sorry she is sick

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MASTIFFAUNTIEB

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Reply with quote  #14 
Has she had BM'S? Are they kind of frothy? Or does it seem like they are kind of mucousy? She may have JUST a very irritated gut from the bone she vomited and then the food she ate made her sick.
Again,
keep us posted

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #15 

ok assuming BM's are bowel movements...yes she has had several and were all normal finally...since the last food inciddent I posted a week ago.  I now think of all these things like "what ever did happen to that little pink bone we bought her when she was little?" Well anyway I am praying its not something stuck there.  She is a little resless but I think i notice it more in her crate because her bed is being washed.....again!


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orcasislandmastiffs

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Reply with quote  #16 
Rawhide and pigs ears are not digestible - so what ever size they chew off and swallow, will go through their entire system. When I owned my all natural pet store, I refused to sell these items in my store as I personally knew of dogs who had died from chewing on both. My personal opinion is raw beef bones, they are large, take awhile to chew and clean the teeth. The others are deadily.

Trish

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Reply with quote  #17 
I see a lot of warnings here,that's oké.
But I don't see one warning about the danger of any pig products.
Don't you know a pig can carry a rabies-virus with him?
Dogs can get very sick of any pig-part.
The can get rabies of eating pigmeat or parts or bones.
It's not the rabies dogs and wolffs normally have,but it's related by it and just as dangerous!!
Pigs don't get vacinations for it cause we human don't get sick of this.
Pleace don't buy pig's again for your dogs it is dangerous!!

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Reply with quote  #18 
what kind of rabies?  Can you tell us more?

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Reply with quote  #19 
It's called Aujeszky's disease also known as pseudorabies.
I was wrong about related to rabies,but the symtomes look a lot like rabies.
That's why they call it pseudo-rabies.
Here are a view links,you can read more about it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorabies

http://www.spc.int/rahs/Manual/Multiple_Species/AUJESZKYSE.HTM

http://www.thepigsite.com/diseaseinfo/11/aujeszkys-disease-ad

http://www.thepigsite.com/articles/2/ai-genetics-reproduction/2277/the-role-of-biosecurity-in-aujeszkys-disease-pseudorabies-control
I think the best you can do is to google this.
Than you will know much more than I can tell you.

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kellybird

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Reply with quote  #20 

wow, I am really interested in this knowledge about pig ears. Who would of thought. THe lady I got my pup from (a good friend who has 3 mastiffs) she said her dogs love pig ears and so thats why i buy them and i do (did) give them very often.  I know so many people who give them to their dogs is it because mastiffs are so big that we have to watch what we give them.   I am not giving her the rest of the bag.  I am watching her closly for any other symptoms but she is eating and pooping normaly.  If I notice a change at all in that I will take her to the vet right away. She hasent thrown up since last nite. 


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SJOUKE

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Reply with quote  #21 
She will probably be alright.
When dogs get sick after eating infected pigs,it mostly just takes a view houres before the first symtomes show.

It might be that the pigs in the US all get vaccinated for this,I don't know.
But here in europe they don't get vaccinations for Aujeszky's disease.
And maby there is a rule that says farmers must vaccinate,
you don't know they all do it.
It probably costs a lot of money so maby some farmers just hope theyr pigs don't get sick.

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Reply with quote  #22 
most of the pigs ears I see say on the bag "Made In China"

that's one reason not to give them! 

there are plenty of other treats you can give and are much more healthy for them. 

yes, mastiffs are a giant breed dog.  So, yes you should be careful what you give them.  They have powerful jaws and can swallow whole ..a lot of treats such as pig ears.  If they can't digest them...

I am also very careful what I give as a "toy"....people on this list can give you idea's for sturdy toys..but even so it's best to keep on eye on your dog while he has a toy or a treat.

Better safe than sorry is my motto.

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Reply with quote  #23 

Thanks for the reminder dixie. For all those new to this breed, tennis balls are a HUGE no no!!  They are the perfect size to lodge across the throat and cause suffocation.


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