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SteveOifer

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http://www.worldmastiffforum.com/search?searchid=12425495

Although it's been discussed before, in lieu of recent events, perhaps now is a good time to approach this subject in depth.

What kind of Mastiff temperament do we want and how do we go about arriving at that?

Is there a universal ideal, or is variability also a subjective attribute when disposition is involved?

Must a protector breed also become unstable, as their protective drive increases, or can a healthy balance be obtained?

Should all protector breeds be placed on Thorazine, so that municipalities & owners will never have to deal with the dangerous dog syndrome?

What say you!



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For the betterment of the breed!

"Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
"If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
" A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
"I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
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dirtpoor

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Reply with quote  #2 
We all know what the ideal is, but when picking a puppy, how can you tell if it has the ideal temperament? What say you!
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And my new boy Elah!!!!!!
SteveOifer

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Reply with quote  #3 

Since in your words, we all know what the ideal is for a Mastiff, perhaps you could delineate those ideal attributes for us, so that we can all agree!


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For the betterment of the breed!

"Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
"If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
" A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
"I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
TEST YOUR DOGS!
Teresa

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Reply with quote  #4 

My ideal is a dog with great discernment! Guard dog when needed but stable as a rock and lovable when the time is fine for that! I think all to often we discount that dogs have better judgement of situation than WE do! If my dogs HATE someone, I usually have the smart to know I should pay attention to that. I do not have one single "aggressive" Mastiff. What I do have in a couple of my girls is that marvelous insight and judgement. THAT'S my ideal Mastiff temperament.


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SteveOifer

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Reply with quote  #5 
I find it strange that whenever one mentions the ability to protect, or guard, some always associate that with aggression, or instability.

No doubt some dogs are off their rocker, but for the most part, if a dog is raised in a good friendly home, they should be relatively stable.

A healthy dog will have seen humans at play and typically understand the difference between play and true fighting.

Being around familiar people, can distort a dog's response, at times, to a given situation. For example, if a neighbor is over often and the dog becomes very friendly towards that individual, the dog might not react the same under a select set of circumstances, had a stranger been involved.

In reviewing Marge's situation, some may be evaluating this through hindsight. It's always easy to look at things in a rear view mirror and then say how lucky she was that things worked out the way they had. It may not be wise to use her example as a template for all to follow, since many alternate fatal scenarios could have emerged from the same actions under the hands of other home invaders.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=dba_1186897689

How should we judge the above video?

Perhaps the store owner would have been killed had the dog not intervened, or perhaps because the dog intervened the store owner could have been shot! Who's to say on which day, which scenario would play out?

We will never know in advance of a home break-in, if an intruder is armed or not, but even if it is known early on, the fast actions of a protector dog might provide you and your loved ones the time necessary to escape and get help!

Nobody wishes to see a family pet get injured, or killed protecting their loved ones, but the dog would willingly give his life for his master and has on many occasions.

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  • Had the police not found the phone, Marge's thug would be out harming, or killing others! Let's not forget that!


    __________________
    For the betterment of the breed!

    "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
    "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
    " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
    "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
    TEST YOUR DOGS!
    SteveOifer

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    Reply with quote  #6 


    Quote:
    "I'm sorry my dog got shot, but I still got my family and we still got our dog," a tearful Shoemaker told News 9. Trawick's father reportedly rescued 2-year-old dog from an abusive home just three months before the break-in.


    Says it all!

    __________________
    For the betterment of the breed!

    "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
    "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
    " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
    "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
    TEST YOUR DOGS!
    SteveOifer

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    Reply with quote  #7 

    Quote:

    News breaking story from CoCo the Blogging Dog. Pit Bull dog saves entire family from intruder. A woman with two young children was abruptly awakened at 2 am in the morning. It was the sound of her window pane on the door breaking. The intruder apparently broke the window and reached inside to open the dead bolt. She stated, "At that point, all I could think about was my children's safety." She rushed to her children's room. The intruder raced after the woman and faced her with a knife. Seemingly out of nowhere, their pit bull dog Buddy leaped on the man. The intruder tried to stab Buddy, but he was no match for this pit bull dog wonder. Buddy bit his hand, knocking the knife away from his reach. During the commotion, the woman was able to call 911. It took the police 5 minutes to arrive, during this time Buddy pinned the man to the ground. Woman stated if the intruder even tried to move, she is sure her pit bull dog would have attacked. As soon as the police arrived, the pit bull dog seemed to understand and let them take the intruder. Afterwards, the pit bull checked out the children and licked their face. Woman reports Buddy was unharmed and will be loved and spoiled for the rest of his life.


    __________________
    For the betterment of the breed!

    "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
    "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
    " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
    "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
    TEST YOUR DOGS!
    SteveOifer

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    Reply with quote  #8 

    Burglar makes the mistake of choosing 22-stone mastiff's home

    By Chris Brooke
    Last updated at 8:54 AM on 09th June 2008

    Of all the gardens in all the world, the thief had the bad luck to break into the one where Cromwell was peacefully gnawing on his bone.

    The three-year-old English mastiff is a gentle pet. But his breed are also born guard dogs  -  and big ones at that.

    Only the thief and Cromwell know exactly what happened next.

    Enlarge   Cromwell, his owner George Watson and the burglar's torn shirt

    Cromwell, his owner George Watson and the burglar's torn shirt

    But it can't have been friendly, as the dog's owner heard a 'scream, a roar and a commotion' from the back garden.

    George Watson, 43, had been having a bath and ran outside in his towel, to see the thief zooming off down the driveway in his van.

    Apart from a very agitated dog, the only evidence the man left behind was the torn Tshirt.

    Mr Watson, who lives with his wife Lesley, 43, and daughter Molly, ten, in Gordon, Berwickshire, assumes Cromwell tore the shirt from the thief's back to stop him stealing the family's lawnmower, which had been taken from the shed and left by the gate.

    Cromwell stands guard: Owner George Watson with son Christopher and daughter Molly

    Cromwell stands guard: Owner George Watson with son Christopher and daughter Molly

    At just under 22 stone the dog could be the world's heaviest  -  so it is lucky that this is all he tore off.

    'By the time Cromwell had finished with it it was covered in holes,' his owner said.

    Mr Watson, a regional manager of an IT company, does not expect the man to return for another go.

    If the burglar decided to make a complaint, Mr Watson could not be prosecuted under the Dangerous Dogs Act because the incident took place on his private property.

    The last dog to hold the title of world's heaviest was Hercules, an English mastiff from the U.S., which weighed 282lb (just over 20 stone) until its recent death.

    The Mastiff's Tale

    The breed now known as the English mastiff was brought to this country by Phoenician traders as early as the 6th century BC.

    After the Roman invasion, they were used to fight in arenas against other large animals such as lions.

    By the end of the Second World War the breed was almost extinct in the UK but was re-established with the help of imports.

    Mastiffs are the heaviest dogs in the world and the normal weight for a fully-grown adult is about 14 stone.

    Although bred as guard dogs, English mastiffs make very good family pets. They are good with children, rarely bark and tend to defend rather than attack.



    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1025039/Burglar-makes-mistake-choosing-22-stone-mastiffs-home-rob.html#ixzz1Ju4qdXQm


    __________________
    For the betterment of the breed!

    "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
    "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
    " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
    "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
    TEST YOUR DOGS!
    SteveOifer

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    Reply with quote  #9 
    A good guard instinctively understands objects under their domain.

    Call it possessiveness, or defending a territorial possession, in either case, it represents an object, or an area they are wired to defend.

    A stranger is not a familiar and a good guard becomes wary of such people, especially when they cross the territorial boundary.

    How a guard goes about it's defense, is what you are referring to Grant.

    Certainly if the guard is defending your young child, you would want it to use all the assets at it's disposal in that defense.

    If a lawn mower is at stake, we might want a lesser confrontation, due to liability issues, even when a thief is clearly at fault.

    The one variable, that rarely gets noticed, is the reaction of the perpetrator.

    Typically, we only get to see the aftermath, never the steps that lead up to the confrontation.

    Usually, if someone is wielding a tire iron, the dog will react differently compared to someone offering it a steak!

    We also expect too much of our guarding breeds.

    Realistically, we don't want vicious dogs defending our hearth & home, but any dog has the capacity to become vicious depending on circumstances. It's wrong to condemn a dog purely based on outcomes. We can't ask the dog what took place and very often a dog uses good discretionary thinking, despite an outcome unfavorable to general public opinion.

    Excessive force is not an issue confined to guarding breeds, as we have seen these past few weeks, even law enforcement is subject to such parameters.

    What more can we ask, or expect, from a family pet?








    __________________
    For the betterment of the breed!

    "Above all, a uniform type should be aimed at by breeders and uniformity of type can only exist in a proportionate ratio in the purity and distinctiveness in any breed"!.........M. Moore
    "If breeds did not adhere to a specific shape, form, and colour range, or if breeders disregarded this blueprint, the breed would degenerate to the point that it would hardly resemble the breed at all. Selective breeding does not just create breeds- it preserves them as well. Breeding purebred dogs inherently means accepting limitations on your freedom to just breed anything"...Catherine McMillan
    " A reinforced consolidation of the American and British standards could be the basis for restoring our breed to the gladiatorial glory of its ancient past, in capability if not in usage".....Norman Howard Carp-Gordon
    "I can live with doubt, or not knowing, rather than to have answers that might be wrong"...Richard Feynman
    TEST YOUR DOGS!
    Janine

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    Reply with quote  #10 
    My two GSD's have totally different barks - reactions - to so many things, I can understand them now and half the time dont even bother getting up to check as I know what it is.
    Bark 1.  Someone walking past the house.  How dare they.
    Bark 2.  Someone walking past the house with a dog, damn them, we will show them how bad ass we are.
    Bark 3.  That blasted white stray cat that torments them.
    Bark 4.  Someone is coming in to visit, quick mum, get up and open the door, we have visitors who are coming just to shower us with love and pats.  MUM, move it.
    Bark 5.  Well, it is not a bark, it that deep growl that tells me that something is not right, body language of dogs is focused and this has saved my car from being stolen on more than one occasion now.  Also my neighbours cars.  The growl is different and means business and it almost says, if I get out, your ass is mine.  Always gets me because on those occasions they have never, ever barked.  Like they know the racket would scare the intruder away.  This way the just alert us humans and leave it to us.
    I dont want dogs I have to be careful of when I have them out in public, I want dogs people can approach and pat, I want dogs that are great with my grandkids and other kids for that matter.  I want dogs who will welcome people into my home when I open the front door.  I also want dogs that I know will protect us if necessary and I really feel, that even though it has never been put to the test, they would come through with flying colours.  
    Janine. 303.JPG  223.jpg  200.jpg  Heather 5.jpg

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